Send Through Isp Or Mail.mydomain.com?

[D9r]

http://www.site-helper.com/email.html#smtp says:

When setting up POP3 account(s) in your e-mail software, you will need to enable SMTP authentication if you choose to use your hosting account for sending mail (instead of using your ISP's mail server).
I've always sent mail from my domain through my ISP's mail server. If I were to start sending through mail.mydomain.com instead, will that work OK or could there be problems? I'm on a shared-hosting account, if that's relevant.

[Mikester]

Originally posted by D9r@Nov 28 2005, 01:56 PM
If I were to start sending through mail.mydomain.com instead, will that work OK or could there be problems? I'm on a shared-hosting account, if that's relevant.

The authentication setup here requires that you POP mail from the server before you send it with SMTP. Once you do that, it should work. :)

[Sean]

Actually, a lot of ISP's block port 25 (SMTP) and force you to go thru them in a misguided attempt to stem spam. (as if that's working, right...90% of my email is spam).

You can test this by using Telnet from a DOS prompt:

c:> telnet mail.yourdomain.com 25

If it returns a message showing the mailserver info, date, version, etc, they you're ok to send via your domain. If you get an unable to connect message or such, then you're ISP is blocking the port and you'll need to use them.

[D9r]

Thanks, Tech1. That's exactly the info I needed. I've never Telneted before; will go try it and see what happens.

(later) I think I did it correctly, but nothing happened. I typed in the command, hit enter, and the screen just went blank. Waited about a minute (am on dialup) and it stayed blank. Will try some test emails sending through mail.mydomain.com and see what happens.

[ozee]

How did you enter the command? You need to open a DOS box first...

Start > Run > then type "cmd" (without the quotes) THEN the command line that Tech1 gave you above.

It sounds like you just typed the command line at the start>run line.

[D9r]

I did:
Start > All Programs > Accessories > Command Prompt
But I like your way better because it's faster.

They both give the same result: a pretty black box with white text:
C:\Documents and Settings\user>

I added the line like so:
C:\Documents and Settings\user>telnet mail.bellasites.com 25

Hitting enter, it shows "Telnet mail.bellasites.com" in the titlebar, and the screen is blank with the blinking cursor. I'm assuming it isn't connecting, but I would have expected some sort of error message.

I'm not having any luck sending the test emails but the settings may not be correct yet. I might just go ahead and contact Earthlink support and ask them but I was hoping to avoid that because it takes too long.

[D9r]

That didn't take long -- I found the answer in their FAQs:

Port 25 blocking
Port 25 blocking will stop spammers from sending out huge waves of unauthorized junk email by preventing EarthLink email from being sent out through any non- EarthLink mail servers. With Port 25 blocking, anyone logged in to an EarthLink access number will only be able to send mail through the EarthLink mail servers, thereby allowing us to block spam sent out through our network.

SECONDARY EMAIL ACCOUNTS
Any EarthLink member who has a secondary email account that is not an EarthLink account or a Web Mail account, will no longer be able to send email using that secondary account's outgoing (SMTP) mail servers. You will still be able to receive email normally through these accounts, but in order to send email, we need you to make a change for us. (You will still be able to send and receive email from any Web-based mail system, such as HotMail, without making any changes to your Web settings.)

EMAIL SOFTWARE SETTINGS
In your email software, please change your outgoing (SMTP) mail server to: blahblah.earthlink.net

This will have no impact on how your sent mail appears or on the ability of people to reply to you at your secondary email account. It simply allows EarthLink to ensure that spam is not being sent out through our network of access numbers.

Providers that block port 25:
NetZero
Mindspring
MSN
Earthlink
Flashnet
MediaOne
AT&T
Verizon
BellSympatico

[D9r]

All this because I thought I'd try to set up an accurate SPF Record (http://www.hostpc.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=2577). Now I'll go see if Earthlink will tell me what their outgoing mailservers are -- I was told somewhere that they may not want to.

[D9r]

"But wait, there's more!"
I just tried connecting via telnet to port 587 instead of 25 (of mail.bellasites.com) and Earthlink let me through. So for now, at least, it appears that I could send outgoing through my domain -- until Earthlink starts blocking that one too. Would they? Hmm. What to do, what to do, ....


220 www16.privatelabeldns.com ESMTP Exim 4.44 Thu, 01 Dec 2005 15:09:22 -0500

[Mikester]

Originally posted by D9r@Nov 30 2005, 02:54 PM
Now I'll go see if Earthlink will tell me what their outgoing mailservers are -- I was told somewhere that they may not want to.

Quoted post

http://kb.earthlink.net/case.asp?article=28968 says

SMTP Server: smtpauth.earthlink.net
* SMTP Authentication Username:Your Email Address
* SMTP Authentication Password:Your Email Password

[D9r]

Originally posted by Mikester+Dec 1 2005, 03:57 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mikester @ Dec 1 2005, 03:57 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-D9r@Nov 30 2005, 02:54 PM
Now I'll go see if Earthlink will tell me what their outgoing mailservers are -- I was told somewhere that they may not want to.

Quoted post
http://kb.earthlink.net/case.asp?article=28968 says
SMTP Server: smtpauth.earthlink.net
* SMTP Authentication Username:Your Email Address
* SMTP Authentication Password:Your Email Password

Quoted post[/b][/quote]
'smtpauth.earthlink.net' is not the outgoing mailserver. It doesn't send mail from Earthlink; it accepts mail from me that I am sending; it then passes it on to other servers that do the actual sending. It's the IPs of those that need to be in SPF Records. (By the way, this actually belongs in the SPF Thread (http://www.hostpc.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=2577), so I copied this post over to there. If anyone has replies about SPF it would be better to post there so all SPF stuff is in the same place. But if not, that's OK too. :))

Someone else explained it so well that I'll quote him:
Alex van den Bogaerdt wrote:

1.) What are the ISP's mailservers (for listing the IPs)? Is it the name of the server that I use as the outgoing server (smtp) in my email program (smtp.ispexample.net)? Or should I look up the mailservers by doing a DNSreport on the ISP's main domain (ispexample.net) and use the list that it generates (mx1.ispexample.net, mx2.ispexample.net, etc).

ispexample.net is an existing domain. I will not use that as an example.

Mail flows from your fingers via your keyboard into a computer, it is transfered to another, again to another, etc. Eventually there is a step where your mail is transfered from something influenced by you (such as your provider) to something influenced by someone else (such as this mailing list). That point is what is important for SPF.

If you submit to smtp.isp.example.net and if smtp.isp.example.net submits to this list, then yes: that's the one.

But if you submit to smtp.isp.example.net, smtp.isp.example.net delivers to viruscontrol.isp.example.net, viruscontrol to outmx.isp.example.net and that last one delivers to this list, the answer is no (and you should be listing "outmx.isp.example.net" instead).

As you can see, you listing smtp.isp.example.net in your email client is not a useful thing to know. The setup at your ISP is. That's why it is preferable to use the include mechanism _if_available_ because then the people with knowledge about their setup (your ISP) maintain that portion of your SPF record.

(By the way, this actually belongs in the SPF Thread (http://www.hostpc.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=2577), so I copied this post over to there. If anyone has replies about SPF it would be better to post there so all SPF stuff is in the same place. But if not, that's OK too. :))

[D9r]

Back to the original question:
I've always sent mail from my domain through my ISP's mail server. If I were to start sending through mail.mydomain.com instead, will that work OK or could there be problems?

In other words, what is the difference performance-wise between sending through Earthlink's mailservers and HostPC's mailservers? I've heard it's complicated to run a mailserver because it has to comply with so many different companies. Would it be "better" to continue sending through Earthlink? Or is something to be gained by sending through HostPC? Is one way any better than the other?

For example, the following post gives me the impression it may be better to continue sending through my ISP, Earthlink.
Originally posted by Mikester+Nov 29 2005, 01:59 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mikester @ Nov 29 2005, 01:59 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Peter@Nov 29 2005, 01:12 AM
Well the new virus sweeping the net has hit me and turned my computer into a spambot! Anyway, it has led me to be black listed on several lists which poses a serious problem with sending e-mails.

Any advice on how to fix this?

Quoted post
Use webmail to send for the time being. Spam blacklists aren't permanent. You should be removed automatically after a month or two.

Go to http://www.dnsstuff.com/ and enter your computer's IP address in the "Spam database lookup" to see how many blacklists you're on and follow the progress of your removal. Chances are, you're not on very many lists.

Quoted post
[/b][/quote]

[D9r]

Originally posted by D9r@Dec 1 2005, 03:15 PM
"But wait, there's more!"
I just tried connecting via telnet to port 587 instead of 25 (of mail.bellasites.com) and Earthlink let me through. So for now, at least, it appears that I could send outgoing through my domain -- until Earthlink starts blocking that one too. Would they? Hmm. What to do, what to do, ....

220 www16.privatelabeldns.com ESMTP Exim 4.44 Thu, 01 Dec 2005 15:09:22 -0500
Quoted post
Got this additional info from the help list:
Steve Yates wrote:

Port 587 is the "e-mail submission" port...in other words, the port that we are "supposed" to be using to send SMTP mail to a server. I *think* this is regardless of whether the server requires authentication. Port 25 is for mail servers to talk to each other.

Scott Kitterman wrote:
Past performance isn't always indicative of future trends, but AFAIK, Port 587 is not blocked by ISPs except in the People's Republic of China.

[Sean]

Earthlink lies.

I have Earthlink cable and port 25 is not blocked.

Maybe on dialups it is, or in certain areas.

Using 587 or 2525 will bypass that problem usually. Fact is, blocking port 25 does very little in the way of stemming spam. the hunderds I get a day is proof of that..lol.